[SystemSafety] The "Real world" [was: Qualifying SW as "proven in use"]

[Steve Tockey]

Bertrand,
The silliest thing in all of this is that the stakeholders are clearly
clueless about the true source of cost in their software projects. We've
actually measured the degree of rework (fixing things that were done
incorrectly earlier, simply, waste) in software organizations to be over
50%. I've got a technical paper on the topic, if anyone wants. I don't
believe I can include attachments on this list, so if anyone wants just
email me direct and I'll sent it back as a PDF attachment.

The root issue here is that corporate accounting systems lie. They are
*cost* accounting systems, not *value* accounting systems. They are great
for measuring how much money was spent, but they fail miserably at
measuring how much money was saved.

The corporate accounting systems will surely measure the cost of doing
everything we're talking about on the list recently. But tell me where the
accounting system measures how much was saved because we did it a better
way? It doesn't. It can't. So the key problem underneath all of this is an
inability for the stakeholders to really see and appreciate the economic
impacts of what's being discussed here. I'm convinced that if they had a
clue of the value of doing things better, they'd demand that it be done
that way.


-- steve



-----Original Message-----
From: "RICQUE Bertrand   (SAGEM DEFENSE SECURITE)"
<bertrand.ricque at sagem.com>
Date: Monday, July 1, 2013 2:05 AM
To: "systemsafety at techfak.uni-bielefeld.de"
<systemsafety at techfak.uni-bielefeld.de>
Subject: Re: [SystemSafety] The "Real world" [was: Qualifying SW as
"proven in	use"]

I agree and I am afraid that we are just requested to stop bothering
stakeholders by raising issues understood as costs.

Bertrand RICQUE
Program Manager, Optronics and Defense Division
 
T +33 (0)1 58 11 96 82
M +33 (0)6 87 47 84 64
23 avenue Carnot 
91300 MASSY - FRANCE
http://www.sagem-ds.com

 


-----Original Message-----
From: systemsafety-bounces at techfak.uni-bielefeld.de
[mailto:systemsafety-bounces at techfak.uni-bielefeld.de] On Behalf Of Martyn
Thomas
Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 10:56 AM
Cc: systemsafety at techfak.uni-bielefeld.de
Subject: [SystemSafety] The "Real world" [was: Qualifying SW as "proven in
use"]

On 01/07/2013 01:01, Les Chambers wrote:
> I encourage the
> brains trust on this list to engage with the aggressive ugliness that is
>the
> real world and consider how we might deal with it.

I recall a lecture given by Dijkstra in 1973. A member of the audience
asked " do your methods work on real world problems?" Dijkstra paused,
and then said quietly "real world problems. Ah yes, those that remain
when you have failed to apply all the known solutions".

Over the years, I have heard many excuses for failures to use
professional engineering methods.

"if we train the programmers, they'll leave for a better paid job".
"we can't hire programmers who are willing to use that programming
language"
"universities don't teach (maths, project management, quality control,
planning, team working ... ...)"
"the customer insists that we use this (buggy) middleware for
compatibility"
"modern software isn't written - it's assembled from lots of (buggy) COTS"
"if we try to include that in the standard, industry will revolt."
"if we were to ask for that evidence, industry would charge us a fortune"

... and many many more.

Most software developers appear to have lost sight of the problem. Every
week, I hear someone use the verb "test" when what they mean is "gain
assurance that  ... is fit for purpose"; this reveals a dangerous,
implicit assumption that "test-and-fix" is the only practical way to
develop software. Most software is still written in languages without
good data structures and strong type-checking. Most software
requirements (and even interface specifications) are written in English
(or another natural language) - perhaps with some diagrams that lack any
rigorous semantics. Most projects have grossly inadequate change
control. I rarely see a risk register that is worth anything (except as
a demonstration that the project manager isn't managing the project).

Is there another trade that (a) builds complex, novel and critical
systems using poorly-qualified staff, (b) almost exclusively uses tools
that have major known defects, (c) builds systems from components of
unknown provenance that cannot be shown to be fit for purpose and (d)
nevertheless claims to be professional engineers?

Surely it is self-evident that the current state of our profession is
unsustainable. Let's stop making excuses and look for ways to accelerate
the changes that we know are needed.

(Which may be what Les was saying in the extract quoted above).

Martyn






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